2014-02-24T00:28:13 *** arvind_khadri has joined #rtems 2014-02-24T00:29:04 *** arvind_khadri has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-02-24T00:48:41 *** sebhub has joined #rtems 2014-02-24T00:49:48 good morning 2014-02-24T00:54:33 sebhub. hi 2014-02-24T01:00:19 chris, do you have any objections with respect to the smp initialization and shutdown patch? i know we have remaining problems, but i think its an improvement 2014-02-24T01:23:48 sebhub, first we are moving office and I am rather busy moving stuff, cleaning and doing that sort of stuff. 2014-02-24T01:25:06 *** nickwithers has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving.) 2014-02-24T01:25:36 I will respond and keep exploring the design and issues. I suspect what is missing is the over top level requirements for RTEMS for SMP. If this was detailed then each patch could be framed in the context of what happens. If there are intermediate steps these can be identified. 2014-02-24T01:26:56 What concerns is the code base being left in a state where we have some of the hacks I have identified and having them fixed or exposed depending on you getting the budget to do the work. 2014-02-24T01:27:20 I need to head out for the night and I will try and get a response when I can. 2014-02-24T01:27:29 ok,, thanks 2014-02-24T01:28:01 we have a tight budget 2014-02-24T02:04:50 *** monstr has joined #rtems 2014-02-24T02:49:53 *** edwardk has quit IRC (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.) 2014-02-24T04:39:54 *** arvind_khadri has joined #rtems 2014-02-24T05:02:46 *** sebhub has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-02-24T05:14:47 *** gigetoo has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-02-24T05:19:39 *** gigetoo has joined #rtems 2014-02-24T07:39:50 *** dunsmoreb_ has joined #rtems 2014-02-24T07:40:42 *** dunsmoreb has quit IRC (*.net *.split) 2014-02-24T07:40:45 *** rokka has quit IRC (*.net *.split) 2014-02-24T07:42:30 *** dunsmoreb_ is now known as dunsmoreb 2014-02-24T07:45:59 *** edwardk has joined #rtems 2014-02-24T07:47:59 *** rokka has joined #rtems 2014-02-24T07:52:59 *** atgreen has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 2014-02-24T09:21:36 *** edwardk has quit IRC (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.) 2014-02-24T09:32:46 *** edwardk has joined #rtems 2014-02-24T09:35:41 *** arvind_khadri has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-02-24T11:00:13 *** verm__ has quit IRC (*.net *.split) 2014-02-24T11:00:18 *** edwardk has quit IRC (*.net *.split) 2014-02-24T11:00:22 *** dunsmoreb has quit IRC (*.net *.split) 2014-02-24T11:00:27 *** monstr has quit IRC (*.net *.split) 2014-02-24T11:00:32 *** gigetoo has quit IRC (*.net *.split) 2014-02-24T11:06:24 *** edwardk has joined #rtems 2014-02-24T11:06:24 *** dunsmoreb has joined #rtems 2014-02-24T11:06:24 *** monstr has joined #rtems 2014-02-24T11:10:32 *** gigetoo has joined #rtems 2014-02-24T11:25:54 *** edwardk has quit IRC (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.) 2014-02-24T11:31:16 *** vipulnayyar has joined #rtems 2014-02-24T11:44:17 *** verm__ has joined #rtems 2014-02-24T11:48:48 *** edwardk has joined #rtems 2014-02-24T12:02:49 *** edwardk has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2014-02-24T13:11:18 *** edwardk has joined #rtems 2014-02-24T13:12:05 *** atgreen has joined #rtems 2014-02-24T13:20:24 *** monstr has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2014-02-24T13:35:31 *** vipulnayyar has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving) 2014-02-24T16:40:39 *** atgreen has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 2014-02-24T16:56:38 *** edwardk has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2014-02-24T17:02:53 gedare, hi 2014-02-24T17:43:43 *** edwardk has joined #rtems 2014-02-24T18:18:16 *** atgreen has joined #rtems 2014-02-24T18:29:09 *** atgreen has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 2014-02-24T18:40:08 *** edwardk has quit IRC (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.) 2014-02-24T19:14:18 *** arvind_khadri has joined #rtems 2014-02-24T19:18:01 *** edwardk has joined #rtems 2014-02-24T19:26:54 *** edwardk has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving...) 2014-02-24T19:29:21 hey kiwichris 2014-02-24T19:29:27 can't seem to quite catch each other. :) 2014-02-24T19:31:01 the perils of being 16 hours apart. 2014-02-24T19:54:45 *** atgreen has joined #rtems 2014-02-24T19:59:46 *** Sched has joined #rtems 2014-02-24T20:16:23 I had to head out but I am back now 2014-02-24T20:19:56 *** edwardk has joined #rtems 2014-02-24T20:45:43 heh. i'm about to go to sleep. 2014-02-24T20:46:00 kiwichris: i have maybe 3 minutes, so maybe next time 2014-02-24T20:47:00 but, i think the best thing to do is to start an smp reqs document and just gather a bunch of notes and stuff, then condense from there to get a concise set of requirements and a summary 2014-02-24T20:47:36 i know i have links to a bunch of various documents related to the smp efforts. they will be good to work from 2014-02-24T20:49:35 Yes,I find a lot of discussion in mail list and it's helpful. 2014-02-24T20:50:30 hi Sched 2014-02-24T20:50:58 Hi, gedare 2014-02-24T20:51:29 Nice dream,see you~ 2014-02-24T20:51:44 thanks. 2014-02-24T20:52:37 nn 2014-02-24T21:06:23 *** arvind_khadri has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-02-24T21:09:54 gedare, sorry back and forth at the moment. Still about 2014-02-24T22:01:22 *** arvind_khadri has joined #rtems 2014-02-24T23:15:13 *** Sched has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2014-02-24T23:39:28 *** shelf has joined #rtems 2014-02-24T23:40:42 howdy RTEMmers 2014-02-24T23:41:02 i'm a gsoc applicant, just going to float about here for a few weeks. 2014-02-25T00:27:42 *** monstr has joined #rtems 2014-02-25T01:05:59 *** vipulnayyar has joined #rtems 2014-02-25T01:08:05 *** vipulnayyar has quit IRC (Client Quit) 2014-02-25T01:31:47 *** edwardk has quit IRC (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.) 2014-02-25T03:11:32 *** gigetoo has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-02-25T03:12:23 *** gigetoo has joined #rtems 2014-02-25T06:18:32 *** arvind_khadri has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 2014-02-25T06:18:44 *** atgreen has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving) 2014-02-25T07:36:36 win 54 2014-02-25T08:37:20 *** edwardk has joined #rtems 2014-02-25T09:56:33 *** edwardk has quit IRC (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.) 2014-02-25T10:15:30 *** edwardk has joined #rtems 2014-02-25T10:24:37 *** edwardk has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2014-02-25T10:52:33 *** edwardk has joined #rtems 2014-02-25T10:55:54 hi shelf 2014-02-25T11:22:51 *** monstr has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 2014-02-25T12:09:25 *** hiddenpearls has joined #rtems 2014-02-25T12:22:01 *** edwardk has quit IRC (Excess Flood) 2014-02-25T12:22:15 *** edwardk_ has joined #rtems 2014-02-25T13:53:33 *** hiddenpearls has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving.) 2014-02-25T16:17:21 *** edwardk_ has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) 2014-02-25T17:01:15 *** edwardk has joined #rtems 2014-02-25T18:17:45 *** shelf has quit IRC (Read error: Operation timed out) 2014-02-25T18:19:53 *** shelf has joined #rtems 2014-02-25T18:33:16 *** edwardk has quit IRC (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.) 2014-02-25T18:37:29 *** edwardk has joined #rtems 2014-02-25T19:10:17 *** javamonn has joined #rtems 2014-02-25T19:14:00 gedare: So I'm eligible for gsoc this year. Any recommendations for projects I should be looking into, stuff I should be reading up on? Work with the TCP/IP stack stands out to me, so does tinyRTEMS 2014-02-25T19:14:58 smp related stuff looks really interesting, I'm just worried I haven't seen enough theory and don't have a ton of time to wrap my head around it fully 2014-02-25T19:15:22 *** edwardk has quit IRC (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.) 2014-02-25T19:56:38 *** edwardk has joined #rtems 2014-02-25T19:58:55 hmm. is there still interest in bringing kqueue across? 2014-02-25T20:07:11 *** Sched has joined #rtems 2014-02-25T20:13:31 *** shelf has quit IRC (Read error: Operation timed out) 2014-02-25T20:16:28 *** shelf has joined #rtems 2014-02-25T20:43:58 hi javamonn 2014-02-25T20:43:59 hi shelf 2014-02-25T20:44:20 hello :> 2014-02-25T20:44:26 hey gedare 2014-02-25T20:44:41 javamonn: smp is hot right now and you should not need to know too much theory with the right project and mentorship. otherwise, i'm not sure about the tcp/ip status i think it is close for at least some targets but more support might be in order 2014-02-25T20:44:51 you'd have to ask on rtems-devel for a status update on tcpip 2014-02-25T20:45:15 tinyrtems is to me somewhat vaguely defined, perhaps the best project related to it would be to unify the various linker scripts (linkcmds)... 2014-02-25T20:45:27 shelf, i think we have now already an initial port of kqueue 2014-02-25T20:45:33 oh! 2014-02-25T20:45:54 http://git.rtems.org/rtems/commit/?id=8cb28826ffaccd2f9f9f0c77c9cfdf61d1100069 2014-02-25T20:45:58 would that be in a 'further work required' state? (the ideas page needs an update) 2014-02-25T20:46:09 or at least some support is in place 2014-02-25T20:46:21 i don't know for certain if the whole support exists for kqueue. you may inquire on rtems-devel about the status. 2014-02-25T20:46:31 ok, i'll do some more research there. 2014-02-25T20:46:36 ideas page tends to lag behind.. it is best effort to keep it up-to-date. 2014-02-25T20:47:09 gedare: I've been watching some lectures on smp and reading a lot of material, I think I want to head in that direction. I've been following the discussions on devel and I'm going to put my time towards learning more and selecting a specific project 2014-02-25T20:47:20 because smp does seem really hot and really interesting 2014-02-25T20:47:25 javamonn: working on smp will give you a lot of exposure and a great experience. 2014-02-25T20:47:34 but, it will be a challenge too, a lot of work 2014-02-25T20:47:44 you definitely need to be sure gsoc is your sole commitment for the summer. 2014-02-25T20:48:01 Those were my thoughts exactly, I'm pretty prepared for that 2014-02-25T20:48:03 but, once you nail down a specific project that can be a big help. 2014-02-25T20:48:06 ok good. 2014-02-25T20:48:35 your first step should be to get an SMP system up 2014-02-25T20:48:47 either i386 or arm realview work with qemu 2014-02-25T20:50:11 ok, I saw that email earlier today where you referenced that, I need to dig through devel for specific info on getting smp set up 2014-02-25T20:52:15 I may also aim for SMP, it seems like there's lots of room for multiple student projects 2014-02-25T20:52:32 i'll check with you closer to application time javamonn , so we don't overlap :> 2014-02-25T20:53:00 I was thinking the same thing shelf, I know there was one more student with an interest that sent an email on rtems-devel earlier today 2014-02-25T20:53:09 my understanding is that theres a lot of work to be done 2014-02-25T20:53:13 you also need to check to be sure there aren't active development projects doing the same thing. 2014-02-25T20:53:29 because there are currently funded projects working on some of the SMP support 2014-02-25T20:53:30 i'm going through the list on the wiki now, and each dot point is a summer's worth of work 2014-02-25T20:53:33 but, there is a lot to be done. 2014-02-25T20:55:22 Where would we check that a project isnt currently active development, is our best shot an email to rtems-devel to be sure? 2014-02-25T20:55:24 i think it would be good if students scope out non-conflicting SMP projects. if we get some synergy among the student projects it can help. 2014-02-25T20:55:40 but, we have to avoid conflicts or the appearance that 2 students are "coding together". 2014-02-25T20:55:46 of course 2014-02-25T20:55:47 yes, email rtems-devel 2014-02-25T20:56:02 so rtems-devel is a better channel for this kind of chatter? 2014-02-25T20:56:10 more reliable channel 2014-02-25T20:56:44 roger 2014-02-25T20:57:46 I hadn't heard of rtems until I met kiwichris at a gsoc meetup in january! 2014-02-25T20:58:21 he sold it well, i'm very keen. 2014-02-25T20:59:39 nice. are you in AU? 2014-02-25T20:59:57 I'm from AU. but i'm on student exchange in the US now 2014-02-25T21:00:06 ah 2014-02-25T21:00:25 which enables me to do GSoC - normally it is not possible due to class overlap 2014-02-25T21:01:16 oh i see, well good fortune 2014-02-25T21:02:35 gtg good night and i look forward to seeing the chatter. :) 2014-02-25T21:02:43 good night 2014-02-25T21:12:28 one last thing, for either of you shelf and javamonn (or anyone else), if you want to learn more about SMP I highly recommend finding a copy of "The Art of Multiprocessor Programming" (revised ed.) by Maurice Herlihy and Nir Shavit. 2014-02-25T21:12:45 it's a great resource to learn about multicore programming theory and practice.. and with that, i'm out 2014-02-25T21:13:05 Thank you for the reference, I was going to ask if you had any book recommendations :) 2014-02-25T21:13:20 goodnight 2014-02-25T21:13:38 oh, thanks a bundle 2014-02-25T21:14:17 where you at javamonn ? 2014-02-25T21:14:29 located** 2014-02-25T21:15:45 North Texas 2014-02-25T21:16:38 I'm an incoming freshman, I worked with rtems for this year's google code in, won grand prize. It's a great project to get involved with 2014-02-25T21:16:57 oh wow. nice work! 2014-02-25T21:17:10 I wish I knew about GCI and such when i was at high school 2014-02-25T21:17:46 I've done gci 2 years now and yeah its a pretty incredible learning experience 2014-02-25T21:18:12 the rtems guys are really friendly 2014-02-25T21:19:05 yeah, that's the impression I get. chris gave me a very good impression and said the mentors all had plenty of time to help students get accustomed 2014-02-25T21:51:47 *** hiddenpearls has joined #rtems 2014-02-25T21:53:05 *** hiddenpearls has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-02-25T21:53:16 *** hiddenpearls has joined #rtems 2014-02-25T22:40:31 *** edwardk has quit IRC (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.) 2014-02-25T23:02:18 *** Sched has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2014-02-25T23:10:05 *** hiddenpearls1 has joined #rtems 2014-02-25T23:12:50 *** hiddenpearls has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2014-02-25T23:17:45 *** javamonn 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2014-02-26T08:21:02 are you eligible for gsoc/ planning to propose a project? 2014-02-26T08:21:18 nope, won't be until 2 years :/ 2014-02-26T08:21:36 ah, ok 2014-02-26T08:21:46 plenty of time to learn more :) 2014-02-26T08:21:57 and you are always welcome to continue to contribute when you can. 2014-02-26T08:21:57 indeed :) 2014-02-26T08:22:08 I wish my school exams would end soon 2014-02-26T08:22:14 and that I had less of Android work to do 2014-02-26T08:31:09 *** arvind_khadri has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-02-26T09:54:44 *** edwardk has quit IRC (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.) 2014-02-26T09:56:59 *** aj92 has quit IRC (Quit: Page closed) 2014-02-26T10:11:23 *** monstr_ has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 2014-02-26T10:11:35 *** arvind_khadri has joined #rtems 2014-02-26T10:18:05 \quit 2014-02-26T10:18:08 *** phipse has quit IRC (Quit: leaving) 2014-02-26T11:25:00 *** edwardk has joined #rtems 2014-02-26T11:40:56 *** arvind_khadri has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-02-26T12:26:52 gedare, hi 2014-02-26T12:35:12 *** vipulnayyar has joined #rtems 2014-02-26T12:53:36 *** shelf has quit IRC (Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net) 2014-02-26T12:54:19 *** shelf has joined #rtems 2014-02-26T13:02:42 *** vipulnayyar has left #rtems ("Leaving") 2014-02-26T14:26:40 hey kiwichris 2014-02-26T15:11:20 *** paulo__ has joined #rtems 2014-02-26T15:15:32 *** paulo_ has joined #rtems 2014-02-26T15:15:38 *** paulo__ has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2014-02-26T15:28:15 *** verm__ has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-02-26T15:28:26 *** edwardk has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2014-02-26T15:34:40 *** verm__ has joined #rtems 2014-02-26T16:01:46 *** edwardk has joined #rtems 2014-02-26T16:10:36 *** hiddenpearls has joined #rtems 2014-02-26T16:47:40 gedare, I am back. Still around ? 2014-02-26T17:02:42 *** kiwichris has quit IRC () 2014-02-26T17:07:25 *** javamonn has joined #rtems 2014-02-26T17:08:27 *** hiddenpearls has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving.) 2014-02-26T17:08:44 gedare: I just saw sebastian's email from yesterday where he expresses his thoughts that it'd be tough to find an smp project suitable for gsoc 2014-02-26T17:09:20 I know he's the one spearheading it atm so I'm wondering if I should look into other projects or if you think differently 2014-02-26T17:18:08 smp just looks so interesting so I'd be bummed if it worked out to be best to tackle something else 2014-02-26T17:35:01 *** edwardk has quit IRC (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.) 2014-02-26T17:44:12 condition variables catch my eye right now, I know a student has already expressed interest in that topic though 2014-02-26T17:46:24 *** edwardk has joined #rtems 2014-02-26T17:56:57 Anyways, I got to go, I'll be back on here later or feel free to email me 2014-02-26T17:58:17 *** javamonn has quit IRC () 2014-02-26T18:07:26 *** paulo_ has quit IRC (Quit: Konversation terminated!) 2014-02-26T18:21:40 *** paulo has joined #rtems 2014-02-26T18:26:46 *** edwardk has quit IRC (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.) 2014-02-26T18:28:06 *** javamonn has joined #rtems 2014-02-26T18:31:00 *** edwardk has joined #rtems 2014-02-26T18:32:14 *** edwardk has quit IRC (Client Quit) 2014-02-26T18:34:07 *** edwardk has joined #rtems 2014-02-26T19:11:28 *** edwardk has quit IRC (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.) 2014-02-26T19:15:48 *** edwardk has joined #rtems 2014-02-26T19:15:51 *** Schoumi has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2014-02-26T19:21:23 *** Schoumi has joined #rtems 2014-02-26T19:27:17 *** edwardk has quit IRC (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.) 2014-02-26T19:27:33 *** kiwichris has joined #rtems 2014-02-26T19:34:27 hi kiwichris 2014-02-26T19:34:38 Hi 2014-02-26T19:34:44 javamonn: condition variables are the only thing that sebastian thinks is appropriate for smp 2014-02-26T19:34:56 for a gsoc project^ 2014-02-26T19:35:00 Why ? 2014-02-26T19:35:15 hmm 2014-02-26T19:35:18 everything else either is changing too quickly, not enough support in place, or they plan to implement. 2014-02-26T19:35:34 i personally haven't looked closely enough 2014-02-26T19:35:48 If it is just because he wants the playground for himself then that is s no reason. 2014-02-26T19:36:24 If this is the case he will need to detail what is happening and why. The wiki list is not detailed and does not discuss the design issues 2014-02-26T19:36:26 he said "the problem is that this SMP stuff is so volatile at the moment that it is hard to predict anything" 2014-02-26T19:36:42 in private email to me 2014-02-26T19:36:45 hang on 2014-02-26T19:36:49 that was the only justification i got from him. 2014-02-26T19:37:14 Then he has a problem 2014-02-26T19:37:22 I am not accepting this positoion 2014-02-26T19:38:00 ok. i won't worry about it. he won't block anything, he just won't participate as a mentor in such projects. but he is likely only to mentor 1 project if at all 2014-02-26T19:38:10 And that is fine. 2014-02-26T19:38:50 SMP is appealing to students and last year and with GCI what they did was impressive 2014-02-26T19:39:24 I now wonder if have aimed a little low and need to put in some good projects 2014-02-26T19:39:57 "put in"? on the open projects list? 2014-02-26T19:40:17 Sebastian says shutdown cannot use just atomics; He may be correct or he maybe be wrong. It is a big call from him. 2014-02-26T19:40:23 rbr 2014-02-26T19:44:44 you can't implement consensus among threads with atomic operations only. 2014-02-26T19:45:07 I suspect this is the basis of his claim. 2014-02-26T19:46:12 The SMP init email thread is showing we are suffering from the lack of requirements. For example .. 2014-02-26T19:46:13 integrating affinity to the scheduler plugins would be good, but not a project by itself. 2014-02-26T19:47:00 oh, that's a shame. i have been researching the condition variables project today 2014-02-26T19:47:44 condition variables is good for gsoc 2014-02-26T19:47:57 looks well suited to my skillset too, i've just come out of OS and concurrency foundations courses 2014-02-26T19:48:23 but i worry we will end up with 4 students who propose to do it ;) 2014-02-26T19:48:30 i think that is what will happen. 2014-02-26T19:48:45 at this stage it is ok just keep reading and researching 2014-02-26T19:48:54 we will help to ensure there is low overlap. 2014-02-26T19:49:04 yeah. each time i get a more solid project idea i will bounce it off you guys 2014-02-26T19:49:30 another one is to work toward having RTEMS run in parallel to another OS on the same multicore system. 2014-02-26T19:49:32 gedare, with the example of NP and AP it is like letting the app configure 1G of RAM and then the BSP saying oh we only have 12*M so I will lower the value. It does not make sense. 2014-02-26T19:50:33 hmm. when you build linux you can configure NR_CPU to any value, but when you boot linux it will detect the # of cores available and that will be what you get 2014-02-26T19:50:37 this is a similar case 2014-02-26T19:51:08 but, i agree the functional requirements for this case are missing 2014-02-26T19:52:38 interrupt affinity could be another smp-related project worth scoping out. 2014-02-26T19:53:29 i'd be very interested in irq affinity 2014-02-26T19:54:17 *** javamonnn has joined #rtems 2014-02-26T19:54:17 *** javamonn has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-02-26T19:55:41 We have different requirements to Linux. For example is having less cores running an error or not. 2014-02-26T19:56:47 The same goes for RAM. I have seen a large system have problems when a memory bank failed and so the RAM available was half and there was no error because the system just went this is all. For embedded this is not good. 2014-02-26T19:57:27 My point being some will want the exact number and some will use less cores but the app value should never exceed the available limit in the hardware 2014-02-26T19:57:59 shelf, that is an interesting topic and important. 2014-02-26T19:58:16 kiwichris: i agree. 2014-02-26T19:58:21 I suspect most systems will fix the application and RTEMS needs to have an API to manage this. 2014-02-26T19:58:30 i'm going to research and will ask some more detailed questions later in the week. 2014-02-26T19:59:09 I feel Sebastian answers are attempting to fit what he has because he is under pressure so it is about a path to real result, ie requirements 2014-02-26T19:59:42 yeah 2014-02-26T20:00:13 shelf, rtems is different to say Linux or FreeBSD because the kernel manages known resources even on buses like PCI. Linux or FreeBSD can have resources come and go. 2014-02-26T20:01:54 gedare, it is really really hard having to do this but I cannot a way around it. Sebastian needs to start the discussion because he is doing the work. It is not up to me to do that. I am afraid needing requirements is maybe too late for his current work so it may have to sit on a branch. 2014-02-26T20:02:45 I will try and get hold of Joel and discuss it with him as he is in Germany. 2014-02-26T20:02:49 ok good. 2014-02-26T20:02:56 i have a full plate myself 2014-02-26T20:03:12 especially with gsoc starting 2014-02-26T20:03:14 I am also willing to step up and help with the requirements because it just has to happen 2014-02-26T20:03:54 i'll try to chip in where i am able. i'm not directly impacted yet, not really a stakeholder in the current discourse. 2014-02-26T20:04:38 if you make Joel aware of this problem, I tihnk he will try to step-up 2014-02-26T20:04:48 although he has been overbooked for the whole last year 2014-02-26T20:04:55 We are all stake holders because the code becomes the projects and if left partially done or with hacks we have to deal with it, ie the core counts 2014-02-26T20:05:24 yes i know that. 2014-02-26T20:06:02 *** edwardk has joined #rtems 2014-02-26T20:06:07 He has been very busy. This is a single project level task we need to get sorted or we have a long range of issues. My current sanity check is "run any app on an SMP and see what happens" and it fails which is not great. 2014-02-26T20:06:25 *nod* 2014-02-26T20:06:44 The test suite hiding the problems is silly. 2014-02-26T20:07:06 ok i gotta go. do try to get in touch with joel 2014-02-26T20:07:41 nn 2014-02-26T20:20:23 *** Sched has joined #rtems 2014-02-26T20:24:10 *** javamonn has joined #rtems 2014-02-26T20:24:11 *** javamonnn has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-02-26T20:35:13 *** Sched has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2014-02-26T20:59:50 *** Sched has joined #rtems 2014-02-26T21:08:17 *** javamonn has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-02-26T21:08:26 *** javamonn has joined #rtems 2014-02-26T21:10:13 *** Sched has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2014-02-26T21:15:36 *** kiwichris has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-02-26T21:26:01 *** kiwichris has joined #rtems 2014-02-26T21:41:07 *** paulo_ has joined #rtems 2014-02-26T21:43:13 *** paulo has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2014-02-26T22:12:19 *** javamonn has joined #rtems 2014-02-26T22:13:38 *** edwardk has quit IRC (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.) 2014-02-26T22:30:12 *** hiddenpearls has joined #rtems 2014-02-26T23:29:20 *** gigetoo has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-02-26T23:30:26 *** gigetoo has joined #rtems 2014-02-26T23:54:35 *** kiwichris has quit IRC () 2014-02-26T23:55:32 *** javamonn has left #rtems 2014-02-26T23:56:41 *** hiddenpearls has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving.) 2014-02-26T23:57:29 *** hiddenpearls has joined #rtems 2014-02-26T23:58:22 *** hiddenpearls1 has joined #rtems 2014-02-26T23:58:22 *** hiddenpearls has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-02-26T23:59:13 *** hiddenpearls has joined #rtems 2014-02-26T23:59:14 *** hiddenpearls1 has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-02-27T00:00:05 *** hiddenpearls1 has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T00:00:05 *** hiddenpearls has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-02-27T00:01:01 *** hiddenpearls has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T00:01:01 *** hiddenpearls1 has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-02-27T00:01:55 *** hiddenpearls1 has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T00:02:56 *** hiddenpearls has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-02-27T00:02:56 *** hiddenpearls has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T00:02:56 *** hiddenpearls1 has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-02-27T00:03:06 *** monstr_ has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T00:03:40 *** hiddenpearls1 has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T00:03:41 *** hiddenpearls has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-02-27T00:04:35 *** hiddenpearls has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T00:04:36 *** hiddenpearls1 has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-02-27T00:05:30 *** hiddenpearls1 has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T00:05:30 *** hiddenpearls has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-02-27T00:06:22 *** hiddenpearls has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T00:06:23 *** hiddenpearls1 has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-02-27T00:07:19 *** hiddenpearls1 has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T00:07:19 *** hiddenpearls has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-02-27T00:08:09 *** hiddenpearls has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T00:08:09 *** hiddenpearls1 has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-02-27T00:09:05 *** hiddenpearls1 has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T00:09:05 *** hiddenpearls has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-02-27T00:09:57 *** hiddenpearls has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T00:09:58 *** hiddenpearls1 has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-02-27T00:10:52 *** hiddenpearls1 has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T00:10:53 *** hiddenpearls has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-02-27T00:11:41 *** hiddenpearls has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T00:11:41 *** hiddenpearls1 has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-02-27T00:12:38 *** hiddenpearls1 has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T00:12:39 *** hiddenpearls has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-02-27T00:13:32 *** hiddenpearls has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T00:13:33 *** hiddenpearls1 has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-02-27T00:14:22 *** hiddenpearls1 has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T00:14:22 *** hiddenpearls has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-02-27T01:03:28 *** sebhub has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T01:04:27 good morning 2014-02-27T01:09:09 *** vipulnayyar has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T01:10:59 *** vipulnayyar has quit IRC (Client Quit) 2014-02-27T01:11:20 *** vipulnayyar has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T01:18:52 *** vipulnayyar has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving) 2014-02-27T01:21:40 *** arvind_khadri has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T01:23:46 *** kiwichris has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T01:35:42 sebhub, hi 2014-02-27T01:35:42 Ralf patch 11 or 17 ... does it contain code from the zynq version with the SLAC license. The TODO is copy. I have no checked the rest. 2014-02-27T01:35:42 11 of 17 2014-02-27T01:52:16 i think he uses the l2cache code from zynq and move it to the shared directory 2014-02-27T02:03:34 *** paulo_ has quit IRC (Read error: Operation timed out) 2014-02-27T02:04:08 *** arvind_khadri has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving) 2014-02-27T02:10:19 *** paulo_ has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T02:17:44 Should there be a reference to Ric and the original code ? 2014-02-27T02:18:05 I have reviewed the code in detail and it is sort of the same but different so I just do not know. 2014-02-27T02:18:28 I am not objecting just asking the question 2014-02-27T02:20:22 Does this code enable the L2 cache on the zynq automatically or is there some config or calls needed ? 2014-02-27T02:20:28 I will be back soon 2014-02-27T02:20:48 sorry, yes, this is a problem i thought he used the original file and only modified it, it seems the file header disappeared 2014-02-27T02:26:31 sorry, i don't know, ralf worked on this project 2014-02-27T02:40:14 *** vipulnayyar has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T02:41:02 *** paulo_ has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 2014-02-27T02:51:39 Ok, I will ask Ralf 2014-02-27T02:54:00 *** vipulnayyar has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving) 2014-02-27T03:44:27 *** kiwichris has quit IRC () 2014-02-27T04:48:28 *** Sched has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T05:12:40 *** sebhub has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-02-27T05:44:37 *** arvind_khadri has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T05:47:49 *** paulo_ has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T05:49:42 *** paulo__ has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T05:52:41 *** monstr_ has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-02-27T05:53:19 *** paulo_ has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2014-02-27T06:09:57 *** vipulnayyar has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T06:18:33 *** vipulnayyar has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving) 2014-02-27T06:38:15 *** Joff has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T06:41:12 *** paulo has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T06:41:28 *** Sched has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2014-02-27T06:43:38 *** paulo__ has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2014-02-27T06:45:53 *** paulo has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2014-02-27T06:46:10 *** paulo has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T07:02:34 hello 2014-02-27T07:04:38 I have a question about RTEMS portablility between BSPs. Is there standards to respect to be able to swith BSP without modifying the application ? 2014-02-27T07:06:44 hi joff 2014-02-27T07:07:29 most applications should be able to move between BSPs without much trouble 2014-02-27T07:07:53 however, applications that rely on some low-level support for periperhals or some exotic board features might not be so portable. 2014-02-27T07:08:19 if your application just uses the rtems or posix api, it should be portable. 2014-02-27T07:09:09 That mean only support for console, clock and timer ? 2014-02-27T07:16:32 Other drivers may vary between BSP ? So the application have to be adaptive to the selected BSP ? 2014-02-27T07:19:10 yeah. some drivers have been made a little more general... 2014-02-27T07:19:35 but for true portability you're stuck with those 3, they're the only ones a BSP is 'required' to implement. 2014-02-27T07:21:06 there are for example drivers for flash disks that some BSPs provide and that can get used by flash filesystem code that applications interface with 2014-02-27T07:21:46 for that kind of situation, the application will be portable to whatever BSPs provide the low-level drivers that the filesystem requires 2014-02-27T07:22:16 but since not all BSPs will provide flash support (or might not even have a flash disk available), such an application is necessarily not portable to any BSP.. 2014-02-27T07:22:33 hope that makes sense. 2014-02-27T07:23:57 Yes, i have better understanding ! Is There defined rules for naming devices under the "/dev/" node ? 2014-02-27T07:37:49 *** vipulnayyar has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T08:19:59 *** vipulnayyar has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving) 2014-02-27T08:41:39 Joff: i doin't know. 2014-02-27T08:47:19 I have an other question about interrupt ! Some BSP define the "set_vector()" function (RTems bsphowto). But in RTems C user guide only the function "rtems_interrupt_catch" is defined in Interrupt Manager. Which function should the application use ? 2014-02-27T08:56:38 *** arvind_khadri has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-02-27T09:21:05 application should use rtems_interrupt_catch(). 2014-02-27T09:21:30 set_vector is internal to BSPs 2014-02-27T09:21:47 *** Schoumi has quit IRC (*.net *.split) 2014-02-27T09:21:48 *** shelf has quit IRC (*.net *.split) 2014-02-27T09:27:12 *** Schoumi has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T09:30:13 *** paulo has quit IRC (Quit: Konversation terminated!) 2014-02-27T09:31:01 does that mean that external interrupt shoud only be processed by BSPs ? Is there asynchronous notification on device driver filesystem (like fasync on linux system) ? 2014-02-27T09:32:06 *** shelf has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T09:32:29 *** shelf has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T09:36:01 *** edwardk has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T09:39:48 *** hiddenpearls1 has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving.) 2014-02-27T09:40:09 *** hiddenpearls has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T09:44:31 Joff: you should be able to register an interrupt handler for any interrupt source in the application. i don't know if there is notification or not, i think there is ongoing work to improve the event notifications in rtems 2014-02-27T09:44:47 but i am not familiar enough with that work or with the filesystem code right now 2014-02-27T09:49:00 *** paulo has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T09:52:18 Ok, thanks a lot for you answers ! 2014-02-27T10:10:00 *** edwardk has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2014-02-27T10:10:39 *** edwardk has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T10:26:45 *** hiddenpearls has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving.) 2014-02-27T10:31:36 *** hiddenpearls has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T10:41:18 *** vipulnayyar has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T10:49:24 *** edwardk has quit IRC (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.) 2014-02-27T10:50:49 *** vipulnayyar has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving) 2014-02-27T11:33:44 *** Joff has quit IRC (Quit: Page closed) 2014-02-27T11:36:04 *** edwardk has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T11:49:36 *** edwardk has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2014-02-27T12:10:34 *** paulo has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving) 2014-02-27T12:20:55 *** hiddenpearls has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-02-27T12:32:29 *** edwardk has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T14:08:24 *** gigetoo has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2014-02-27T14:12:58 *** gigetoo has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T14:27:22 *** mib has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T15:41:19 *** edwardk has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-02-27T15:49:52 *** edwardk has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T16:43:08 *** edwardk has quit IRC (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.) 2014-02-27T17:27:47 *** kiwichris has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T17:41:26 *** gigetoo_ has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T17:45:12 *** gigetoo has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) 2014-02-27T17:45:20 *** gigetoo_ is now known as gigetoo 2014-02-27T17:49:30 *** javamonn has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T17:54:55 *** edwardk has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T18:37:37 *** dunsmoreb has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 2014-02-27T18:38:00 *** dunsmoreb has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T18:39:12 *** Sched has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T19:03:32 *** gigetoo has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-02-27T19:04:25 *** gigetoo has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T20:58:00 is there a list somewhere of remaining jobs from Google Code-In? 2014-02-27T20:58:50 i'm just looking for small digestable things to do as I learn my way around the codebase 2014-02-27T21:03:00 hmm give me one second shelf 2014-02-27T21:04:14 https://www.google-melange.com/gci/org/google/gci2013/rtems 2014-02-27T21:04:35 a lot of the bug fix ones are good to get a handle of the internals a little bit 2014-02-27T21:04:58 oh, thanks! GCI only finished very recently, right? 2014-02-27T21:05:31 yup, January 10th ish 2014-02-27T21:06:26 thanks a bundle! found an area of focus yet? 2014-02-27T21:07:35 Unfortunately no. I would love to do some degree of kernel hacking but I'm not sure what would be appropriate and what sebastian plans to implement himself 2014-02-27T21:07:47 I'm hoping he'll reply to the email I sent to devel earlier 2014-02-27T21:08:26 it just seems like the requirements for SMP aren't clearly established yet and theres a good degree of friction among sebastian and chris regarding the approach 2014-02-27T21:08:45 You sticking with irq affinity? 2014-02-27T21:09:02 yeah, that will be my #1 proposal 2014-02-27T21:09:33 i will file one for CVs also 2014-02-27T21:09:49 but there's so many emails about that 2014-02-27T21:09:59 I just want some general idea of something to pursue and research 2014-02-27T21:10:07 yeah I'm not going to touch CVs 2014-02-27T21:10:24 I know gedare mentioned he wouldnt mind some overlap so you never know 2014-02-27T21:10:27 there's still plenty of time. and thanks to your history with the project, you are 99% likely to get selected! 2014-02-27T21:11:09 anyway, thanks for that link. bug hunt time, just got my sparc build up 2014-02-27T21:11:34 No problem. I still need to get around to getting the smp set up in qemu 2014-02-27T21:13:03 One of those bugs looked really interesting, I never got around to it though 2014-02-27T21:13:27 I think it was a spurious interrupt #5 or something 2014-02-27T21:14:05 popped up on linux from time to time too and no one really knows why 2014-02-27T21:14:12 at least from cursory research 2014-02-27T21:16:30 this one: https://www.rtems.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=1706 2014-02-27T21:20:13 that... is certainly meaty 2014-02-27T21:47:52 https://www.rtems.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=2124 would be probably worth close to a gsoc. 2014-02-27T21:50:57 if you send a CV proposal you should propose something else too, so we can avoid conflicts. never know if the other person that proposes CV will get picked or not, so if you really like the project it could be worth writing up. 2014-02-27T21:53:55 I didn't realize you could submit multiple proposals to the same project... I might be researching CVs as a backup but I'd like to find a focus that would avoid conflicts 2014-02-27T21:54:29 ahhhhh the strict order mutex :) 2014-02-27T21:57:23 Maybe I'm underestimating the amount of work it would require, I think it would be a big undertaking but I don't know about a summers worth 2014-02-27T21:57:43 still, thanks for reminding me of that, I'll keep that one in mind 2014-02-27T22:04:50 *** Sched has quit IRC (Quit: Page closed) 2014-02-27T22:12:21 *** javamonn has quit IRC (Quit: Bye) 2014-02-27T22:13:46 *** javamonn has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T22:26:31 *** Sched has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T22:27:27 *** arvind_khadri has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T22:42:47 *** shelf has quit IRC (*.net *.split) 2014-02-27T22:48:41 *** shelf has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T22:49:18 *** shelf has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T23:00:18 *** javamonn has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 2014-02-27T23:00:59 *** javamonn has joined #rtems 2014-02-27T23:08:48 *** verm__ has 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*** gigetoo has joined #rtems 2014-02-28T21:51:23 Hmm 2014-02-28T21:51:58 The irc logger hasn't logged anything in 2014... 2014-02-28T22:34:03 might not be running anymore 2014-02-28T22:34:08 ask kiwichris i think he set it up 2014-03-01T01:45:29 *** edwardk has quit IRC (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.) 2014-03-01T03:08:52 *** vipulnayyar has joined #rtems 2014-03-01T03:29:45 *** vipulnayyar has joined #rtems 2014-03-01T03:33:12 *** vipulnayyar has quit IRC (Client Quit) 2014-03-01T05:38:08 *** javamonn has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-03-01T08:30:15 *** vipulnayyar has joined #rtems 2014-03-01T08:57:30 *** vipulnayyar has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving) 2014-03-01T09:35:33 *** edwardk has joined #rtems 2014-03-01T09:40:43 *** edwardk_ has joined #rtems 2014-03-01T09:40:46 *** edwardk has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 2014-03-01T09:47:55 *** vipulnayyar has joined #rtems 2014-03-01T13:36:04 *** vipulnayyar has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving) 2014-03-01T13:58:36 *** javamonn has joined #rtems 2014-03-01T14:00:14 gedare: do you think adding fine grained locking in as many places as possible would be an appropriate project? 2014-03-01T14:00:36 thread restart/delete seems really interesting too, but I know sebastian was planning to do that 2014-03-01T14:00:54 I don't want to step on his feet which is why I keep seeking his approval on smp stuff 2014-03-01T14:01:17 I might write up a proposal on it anyways 2014-03-01T14:02:29 right now I'm thinking the strict priority mutex, fine grained locking, and thread restart 2014-03-01T14:02:40 as proposals that is 2014-03-01T17:51:43 *** javamonn has quit IRC (Quit: Bye) 2014-03-01T19:00:49 *** javamonn has joined #rtems 2014-03-01T20:08:51 javamonn: fine-grained locking should be good to work on. strict priority mutex might need something else added to it to make a full summer's work 2014-03-01T20:10:06 i would hazard a guess and say there is about 100-200 hrs of work to do the strict priority mutex... 2014-03-01T20:11:33 it could be combined with smp implementations of locking algorithms 2014-03-01T20:11:52 That was my thought on the strict priority mutex, I remember thinking it would be a reasonable undertaking to do post gci for fun 2014-03-01T20:12:04 I thought sebastian had smp locks done? 2014-03-01T20:13:45 thoughts on thread restart/delete? 2014-03-01T20:15:31 I'm trying to finish art of multiprocessor programming before apps open up, it's a really good text so far 2014-03-01T22:52:26 *** vipulnayyar has joined #rtems 2014-03-01T23:00:25 *** vipulnayyar has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving) 2014-03-02T01:36:32 *** edwardk_ has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-03-02T01:36:40 *** Sched has joined #rtems 2014-03-02T01:36:57 *** edwardk has joined #rtems 2014-03-02T03:32:53 *** gigetoo has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) 2014-03-02T03:34:24 *** gigetoo has joined #rtems 2014-03-02T04:45:13 *** arvind_khadri has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 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kiwichris has joined #rtems 2014-03-02T18:08:09 javamonn: i think there are more kinds of useful locks to implement. not certain though what the status is for sure, you'd have to try to get info out of sebastian. 2014-03-02T18:36:12 *** Sched has joined #rtems 2014-03-02T22:05:38 *** Sched has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 2014-03-02T22:40:27 *** kiwichris has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 2014-03-02T22:42:56 *** kiwichris has joined #rtems 2014-03-02T23:28:51 *** kiwichris has quit IRC () 2014-03-02T23:45:49 *** arvind_khadri has joined #rtems